When I Say Go

[Pongo]

A tarp that is commonly used as we all know is to do "go" tarps. i.e. T's can only do the order when the lead says go.

 

This works fine when it is said at the start of an order such as "All T's when I say go get to X"

 

The issue I see is that people are saying it in the following method "All T's get to X, when I say go". Whilst I agree this is perfectly logical when given as a single continuous order, there are 2 main problems that I see re-occuring from my embrassasing amount of play time on jailbreak:

1. Some leads will intentionally pause between giving the order and "when I say go", almost waiting for the T's to move before giving the tarp, which is clearly unfair.
   
2. When a very long order is being given this seems illogical. For example "All T's at the first archway of blue room run through blue room run through soccer run through the right side of obs get on top of hurdles controls and freeze, when I say go" (I've even seen people add onto that order with get to the first trashpile in dogehouse). Whilst I agree this would be fine if everyone knew that you need to wait until the end of the order to move, time and time and time and time again I see people getting freekilled by CT's because they are assuming that T's are delaying. This is because this order can take 10-15 seconds to actually say in it's entirety so CT's just see T's standing still for 15 seconds when an order has "been given" although not completed and kill them for delaying. Like I say, I and most experienced players know that you should wait until the end of the order to move but unfortunately not everyone is an expereinced player (or have 2 brain cells to rub together - shoutout to 95% of jailbreak players).
   

I just think allowing when I say go to be said at the end just causes a lot of confusion/freekilling and would just be easier if it was required to be said at the start.

 

Apologies for the nitpicking nature of this post but this has been something grinding my gears over the past fews weeks (and I know it annoys a lot of other players as well).

[Happy Feet!]

i agree with all of this! also is that the real sassy?

[Vel'Roz]

If they continue the order then Ts have to stand still until the order is finished. After the order is finished the ts have to wait till he says go. CTs have to give the Ts atleast three seconds after he says go. (3 seconds after every order) and if the lead deliberately pauses between the order and "when i say go" then it's counted as a new order and any Ts killed doing the order after the pause but before he said "when i say go" were freekilled.

Hope this isnt confusing!

 

EDIT: Oh, you're suggesting. I mean, some things could be added to the bible, like waiting till the order is finished to move (Ts) or wait until the lead is finished giving an order to kill anyone not doing the order (excluding rebels) (CTs) but it should be common sense by now

Edited April 4, 2017 by Vel' Roz

[bobbythed]

As I've expressed in many locations before I personally despise this shitty tarp. Reasons are explained pretty well above but I'll add my two cents anyways.

 

Every single time it is said the entire server audibly moans in disbelief at how rude the lead is, I've been freekilled more times than I can count by even experienced CTs for delaying (even had mods bait by running up to the stack and almost hit them with my timeout cannon), and it's led to other people saying "when I say go" after any long order the lead chooses to give. I've started handing out mutes to curb these false orders, but I'm positive it's going to continue to be a trend until this order is disallowed.

 

On top of that it actively slows down days as usually Ts are safe to jump the gun on the order allowing leads to move Ts much faster leading to more enjoyable and lengthy LRs.

 

If I had the power to do so I would add one of these two options to the bible, HIGHLY preferably the first, but if that is impossible the second.

 

1. When doing any form of "when I say <word>" order the word and delay must be specified prior to the order being given.

 

2. CTs must give 3-5 seconds after the entirety of an order is complete before shooting anyone for delaying. This means long orders may require Ts to wait for a considerable amount of time prior to moving.

 

Even further on top of this it appears that Reddevil specifically ruled this tarp invalid back in March of 2013 for the exact reasons this post is discussing.

 

https://hellsgamers....lls#entry470492

Use to do this tarp alot before red banned it cause noobs are stupid but I would say "All ts go to closet corner of big cage when I say go" so they all move before the order is finished and I get a bunch of kills. March 2013

 

Please can we just be rid of this cancer already?

 

Edit: Say hello to my newest bind. bind ' "say Bobby's banlist is now in effect. If you are caught ending an order 'with when I say go' you will be blocked on steam and ignored ingame for a day. Second offense is a week, third is permanent. Don't be a dickhole."

Edited April 4, 2017 by bobbythed

[Jeri :)]

If leads want to be assholes and put it at the end I feel like they should be allowed to. Doesn't mean they won't get flamed for it (trust me they should). If they are putting a gap in the order they should be slayed because that's dirty, but if it's a continuous order it's fine by me.

 

T's are also supposed to wait until an order is completed if I'm not mistaken. Just because people run through blue room during those long orders doesn't mean they should.

[Jeri :)]

If Reddevil banned this order back in 2013, then we need to find the source of the ruling. He banned it for a reason, probably because it would require a nitpicker to understand that you need to wait for an orders completion before moving. The article Bobby linked provides only a reference to a time when Reddevil announced the banning of this order, so let's dig deeper and see what we can find. In my mind, we should consider what his reason for banning it was before we come to a verdict and lock the thread

 

If you add "T's must wait until an order is completed to move" or something along those lines (keep in mind I'm pretty sure it's already a thing that you have to wait for an order to completed) the problem is solved rather than going on a wild goose chase to ban a specific order. It's really not that big of a deal as people make it out to be. Getting mad and upset about stuff like this is when you will see more and more people doing the order to get you guys mad. Threads up. Staff can see it. Relax.

[Vel'Roz]

Lets just summon RedDevil. Cant be that hard?

[Thomasjosif]

lol.

 

The rules have been the same forever. You wait for the order to be complete, then you proceed. No need to change everything because people can't follow simple guidelines.......... My 2 Canadian Pesos!

[Pongo]

Not trying to be sassy (because I'm pongo, not sassy, contrary to popular belief) but just because a rule has been in place for a long time doesn't always mean it's right (Slavery, Women's rights, Brexit etc etc.)

 

Although it is a rule that you should wait until the order is complete to execute it, in reality we all know that people do it as the order is being said and it is generally accepted that it's what people do, long-lasting consistent behaviour from the players has almost nullified this rule, until this tarp blew up in popularity, that is.

[Jeri :)]

Although it is a rule that you should wait until the order is complete to execute it, in reality we all know that people do it as the order is being said and it is generally accepted that it's what people do, long-lasting consistent behaviour from the players has almost nullified this rule, until this tarp blew up in popularity, that is.

 

Correct. I'm not saying it's not okay to move with the order as it's going, but you need to accept the validity of the tarp considering the T's are supposed to move after the order is completely finished.

[Thomasjosif]

Although it is a rule that you should wait until the order is complete to execute it, in reality we all know that people do it as the order is being said and it is generally accepted that it's what people do, long-lasting consistent behaviour from the players has almost nullified this rule, until this tarp blew up in popularity, that is.

 

Just because people are being eager beavers, and starting to go to the location before the order has finished, doesn't instantly make it a problem. This is an example of how it sounds to me: "Alot of people have been freekilling lately, and because noone was punished it has nullified the rule and freekilling is now ok!" That changes the angle of how I see you trying to justify changing this. I believe it's ok to change the Go tarp, and make sure that people said When I say go first.... But you still have to listen to the FULL and COMPLETE order before doing it. Imaging you were in the middle of an order, yet CT's were still getting there, but the T's have already proceeded and killed the CT.

[Pongo]

Just because people are being eager beavers, and starting to go to the location before the order has finished, doesn't instantly make it a problem. This is an example of how it sounds to me: "Alot of people have been freekilling lately, and because noone was punished it has nullified the rule and freekilling is now ok!" That changes the angle of how I see you trying to justify changing this. I believe it's ok to change the Go tarp, and make sure that people said When I say go first.... But you still have to listen to the FULL and COMPLETE order before doing it. Imaging you were in the middle of an order, yet CT's were still getting there, but the T's have already proceeded and killed the CT.

 

I understand what you are saying

 

The TL;DR didn't read of it, is that it's a bullshit crappy tarp for bullshit crappy leads that just makes for bullshit crappy days and makes everyone not enjoy their time. Plus it just lacks common sense, like peace said:

 

I've personally always thought that the "when I say go" part of the order, or any validating statement that conditionally approves the order to be followed (like Simon says), should be positioned at the beginning of the order.

[SupaNipplez]

I've personally always thought that the "when I say go" part of the order, or any validating statement that conditionally approves the order to be followed (like Simon says), should be positioned at the beginning of the order.

 

 

 

any validating statement that conditionally approves the order to be followed (like go orders), should be positioned at the beginning of the order.

 

This is what the rule is now, it has been changed in the bible.

 

Lead now must say "when i say go" BEFORE he/she gives the order, not after.