ZE Suggestions

[iProbie]

Zombie Escape in Garry's Mod is a weird one. CS:GO and CS:S Zombie Escape's concept is all about humans busting their asses off to not let zombies get them and coursing through the map. The only way that doesn't happen is when the server settings or the map is fucked.

But not here. Currently, ZE is used to farm points by the humans or the few zombie mains who can sneak up and score hits here and there. You'd have that 3-4 same humans every round with their TMP or SG550 farming the shit out of zombies, gaining 250++ points per round (which in ZE lasts 4-5 minutes instead of regular ZS which can last 15-20 minutes). The same goes for the top 3-4 zombies who can bunnyhop or spam crouch and jump to avoid hit detection and claw humans, gaining massive 200++ points in one go. The root of the problem comes from the fact that current ZE is too forgiving for humans.

To understand this, let's look at some reasons why:

1. CS:GO and CS:S ZE zombies one hit kill humans (except when the map has items/triggers to prevent this) and instantly turn infected humans into zombies with FULL hp and no death/revive animations. Infected humans instantly become a zombie and in a split second joins his undead brethren in the chase.

2. Zombies have too few of hp. For comparison, popular CS:GO ZE servers have 10,000 HP zombies and many popular maps also trigger zombies to have up to 50,000 HP (which oddly doesn't work in gmod). Not to mention that in CS:GO and CS:S, weapons don't deal nowhere near as much damage as GMOD ZE (can you imagine if SG550 has 200 base damage in CS:GO or CS:S??)

3. CS:GO and CS:S ZE zombies sometimes have varieties. This point is not the most crucial thing in the list but the idea of having multiple zombie types should be entertained.

4. Zombies cannot jump once shot and the slowdown from being shot lasts way too long. This is bullshit imo and needs to be changed.

 

Sure, OBJ maps are also a slaughterfest for humans. But at least in OBJ mode, humans have to buy expensive guns, cade and not have unlimited ammo. 

 

 

Here's a list of suggestions to make ZE harder for humans and not a point-farm fest:

a. Make zombies 1 hit kill all humans like the og ZE. Before you go on a rant on how that's stupid, read other suggestions first. If this is too much, then significantly increase the swing speed of zombies. Something like 350% or 400% buff. Yes, give zombies meth.

b. Remove the ambient darkness for humans caused by massive zombie swarm. This is a bigger issue than you'd think. Now that zombies are a dangerous threat, the reduced visibility from a zombie swarm can overrun the human teams easily. This is a good compromise for all other zombie buffs.

c. Massively increase zombies HP or massively nerf guns' damage. Adjust bosses' HP accordingly if the latter is chosen. 7,000 base HP is a minimum if former is chosen. Furthermore, make knockback have more kick and remove the 2-3 sec slowdown when getting shot as a zombie. Also zombies should still be allowed to jump when getting shot. Add a bit of regeneration for zombies while you can.

d. Add more varieties of zombies, unlockable by F3. Multiple variants that fits ZE theme:

-fast zombie (just a faster but more frail regular zombie without the ability to jump/leap and scale walls)

-poison zombie (have more hp and different hitboxes but lack the ability to throw poison)

-ghoul (has slowdown effect, irrelevant in case you decide to make zombies 1-hit kill humans)

-bloated zombie (instead of throwing poison upon death, this zombie has massive health regeneration but is slower than regular zombie)

-half zombie (regular zombie's torso+head, sneaky at times due to close-to-ground hitbox but prone to headshots and have more knockback)

 

 

 

Edited April 5, 2019 by iProbie

[Snowyamur]

Quote

The root of the problem comes from the fact that current ZE is too forgiving for humans.

I disagree. While winning ZE has become more uncommon nowadays, many players, especially Kleiners, still die quickly to map objectives or getting caught, and the game mode for our ZS server isn't really forgiving given that there are mechanics on some maps that insta-kill players or leave them behind to die from zombies or being instantly killed by trigger_hurt. In fact, because we get many new players every day on our ZS server, and because they die from not knowing how certain ZE maps work, I'd say there isn't forgiveness if humans are being rapidly-outnumbered due to Kleiners dying.

The forgiveness would be redeeming humans at a certain point on a ZE map, which will never happen because that would make ZE boring.

 

Quote

To understand this, let's look at some reasons why:

1. CS:GO and CS:S ZE zombies one hit kill humans (except when the map has items/triggers to prevent this) and instantly turn infected humans into zombies with FULL hp and no death/revive animations. Infected humans instantly become a zombie and in a split second joins his undead brethren in the chase.

2. Zombies have too few of hp. For comparison, popular CS:GO ZE servers have 10,000 HP zombies and many popular maps also trigger zombies to have up to 50,000 HP (which oddly doesn't work in gmod). Not to mention that in CS:GO and CS:S, weapons don't deal nowhere near as much damage as GMOD ZE (can you imagine if SG550 has 200 base damage in CS:GO or CS:S??)

3. CS:GO and CS:S ZE zombies sometimes have varieties. This point is not the most crucial thing in the list but the idea of having multiple zombie types should be entertained.

4. Zombies cannot jump once shot and the slowdown from being shot lasts way too long. This is bullshit imo and needs to be changed.

Keep in mind that the mechanics you provided are for the same game mode on a different game. ZS-ZE works differently in Garry's Mod compared to how pure-ZE works in CS:GO due to differently-designed and adjusted mechanics to make both game modes fair for their respective games.

[Snowyamur]

Quote

a. Make zombies 1 hit kill all humans like the og ZE. Before you go on a rant on how that's stupid, read other suggestions first. If this is too much, then significantly increase the swing speed of zombies. Something like 350% or 400% buff. Yes, give zombies meth.

I'd say no to this, and I can't take this one seriously with your last statement for this suggestion. If we make it where zombies insta-kill on hitting a human once, people would whine and complain about this mechanic being too overpowered, and many players would die too fast with little to counter this, resulting in humans being overwhelmed and losing too early. This would also result in a lot of players leaving, which isn't what we want, so no, we aren't going to buff zombie attack speed and/ or attack damage by 4x the amount because that's broken.

 

Quote

b. Remove the ambient darkness for humans caused by massive zombie swarm. This is a bigger issue than you'd think. Now that zombies are a dangerous threat, the reduced visibility from a zombie swarm can overrun the human teams easily. This is a good compromise for all other zombie buffs.

Yes, let's give more of a reason to make ZE maps a horrible game mode to play when humans can barely win it due to mechanics making it virtually impossible to even play from the start. I feel like at this point, you're intentionally trying to hate on players that go human.

 

Quote

a. Make zombies 1 hit kill all humans like the og ZE. Before you go on a rant on how that's stupid, read other suggestions first. If this is too much, then significantly increase the swing speed of zombies. Something like 350% or 400% buff. Yes, give zombies meth.

b. Remove the ambient darkness for humans caused by massive zombie swarm. This is a bigger issue than you'd think. Now that zombies are a dangerous threat, the reduced visibility from a zombie swarm can overrun the human teams easily. This is a good compromise for all other zombie buffs.

Yes, I read what you wrote in a.) about not ranting before, but these two suggestions combined? This isn't okay. Reduced visibility and 4x damage for zombies on ZE, when the current version of ZE for Garry's Mod works fine?

Sorry, but if things aren't broken, don't try to fix them because you might just make it worse. Players will complain even more if we implement these two mechanics together because impaired vision and being killed instantly is the definition of "Who decided to incorporate these mechanics?" Being human at that point would just be a torture to play.

 

Quote

c. Massively increase zombies HP or massively nerf guns' damage. Adjust bosses' HP accordingly if the latter is chosen. 7,000 base HP is a minimum if former is chosen. Furthermore, make knockback have more kick and remove the 2-3 sec slowdown when getting shot as a zombie. Also zombies should still be allowed to jump when getting shot. Add a bit of regeneration for zombies while you can.

Okay, making zombies tankier would ruin the point of being able to hold an objective point on a ZE map because there would be no way to hold zombies back that are too tanky. Having zombie health be set at 7000 HP minimum is way too high, especially since not all humans shoot; some play through the objectives on ZE while wielding knives for movement because they know for fact that other players won't do the ZE objectives. That's a lot of loss DPS there, and there's no blaming them for that; you aren't obligated to shoot zombies on ZE, but if all humans die, then it's the team's fault, not one individual's fault.

More knockback when being hit by a zombie? Sure, I could see that happening.

Having a 2-3 second slowdown on a zombie? Isn't that already the slow down for being shot as a zombie already?

Allow zombies to jump being shot? You're really hating on humans at this point... If we let zombies jump when being shot, then how are humans supposed to hold them back? Remember, humans have 100 Armor and Health, zombies have 3000-4000 health and deal ~70 damage per hit. Why are we turning this game mode into Prepare to Die at this point?

[IamDakota]

Humans get slammed 90% of the time mostly to new players not knowing a map or somebody not taking initiative to lead them. Zombie team is perfectly fine the way it is, also this is a zombie survival server not zombie escape server  we have very few zombie escape maps and don't want to make it too in favor of zombie team. I'm a big NO for adding different zombie classes to this game mode not only will it make zombies over powered but people would just z main ze instead of playing human, we already lose most of the time as is.

[Snowyamur]

Quote

a. Make zombies 1 hit kill all humans like the og ZE. Before you go on a rant on how that's stupid, read other suggestions first. If this is too much, then significantly increase the swing speed of zombies. Something like 350% or 400% buff. Yes, give zombies meth.

b. Remove the ambient darkness for humans caused by massive zombie swarm. This is a bigger issue than you'd think. Now that zombies are a dangerous threat, the reduced visibility from a zombie swarm can overrun the human teams easily. This is a good compromise for all other zombie buffs.

c. Massively increase zombies HP or massively nerf guns' damage. Adjust bosses' HP accordingly if the latter is chosen. 7,000 base HP is a minimum if former is chosen. Furthermore, make knockback have more kick and remove the 2-3 sec slowdown when getting shot as a zombie. Also zombies should still be allowed to jump when getting shot. Add a bit of regeneration for zombies while you can.

These three mechanics together combined is not okay at all. This is stupidly-unbalanced and unfair for humans to the point that ZE would be hell for anyone that wants to actually play it to enjoy it or win.

 

Quote

d. Add more varieties of zombies, unlockable by F3. Multiple variants that fits ZE theme:

I'm going to stop you right there with this. We would be over-complicating a simplified game mode like ZE if we decided to add more zombie varieties. The point of ZE is that it's a path-based game mode; adding zombies that could traverse or navigate said paths differently would be breaking the game mode itself. It's supposed to be brain-dead in-terms of what humans have to do when it comes to killing and running from the zombies, it's supposed to be intelligent when doing the objectives for a ZE map.

Adding zombie varieties is also pointless to do given that all zombies on ZE are super zombies, which take care of humans faster than all the other zombie types combined. Plus, they move as fast as the humans do, so it's fair game if a human gets caught.

[Snowyamur]

Overall, I don't think you thought this one through @iProbie. You're dismissing the fact ZE on CS:GO works differently than ZE for Garry's Mod, despite both being the same game mode with similar gameplay. While the suggestions you provided may work on CS:GO, again, CS:GO and Garry's Mod are two different games.

These suggestions would completely ruin ZE for everyone because you're making zombies too overpowered and an extremely unfair match against the humans.

As you've probably guessed from all that I've typed, this is a huge no from me. We can't have this; humans lose ZE a lot already, even today they still do. Let's not make it a hell for them.